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Joe Gamma

TopoR 5.2.1 Comments and Questons

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Greetings from California! B)

First, well done with the TopoR program. A unique concept, with a good (and improving) UI.

I am using it with Eagle 5.11.

 

One interesting feature for possible future updates:

For circles, if the line width is 0, make the circle a filled area.

The Polygon equivalent is a little difficult to draw, and results in

an output that doesn't quite match the circle when imported back to Eagle.

 

Keep up the good work, this tool is about to save me at least 3 weeks of time on one project.

I do not understand why it is not used more in the USA.

-- Joe

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Greetings from California! B)

First, well done with the TopoR program. A unique concept, with a good (and improving) UI.

I am using it with Eagle 5.11.

Keep up the good work, this tool is about to save me at least 3 weeks of time on one project.

I do not understand why it is not used more in the USA.

 

Thank you Joe :)

 

 

One interesting feature for possible future updates:

For circles, if the line width is 0, make the circle a filled area.

The Polygon equivalent is a little difficult to draw, and results in

an output that doesn't quite match the circle when imported back to Eagle.

 

First of all, I'd like to ask how did you manage to import the project back into Eagle, as we only import from, and don't return back. Would like to know what's the trick there.

 

 

As for the circles and polygons, I'd like to ask for more details. Are you talking about circle copper area? What's the problem with creating one?

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Sorry for late reply: project was interrupted by about 7 new "#1-priority" tasks. :huh:

Back on track:

 

1. Thanks to the excellent Описание формата TopoR PCB, I wrote an application to convert FST to Eagle SCR.

Using MS VC# 10 Express, the XML Namespace API(System.XML.Xpath) makes this task much easier.

 

2. re: Circles and Polygons:

Of course, if I had read #8 in the help file Specifics section, on Coppers, this would

not even be a question. The issue with filled circles is that the wires entering them are clipped at the circumference after Refine Wires and Freestyle... Just as the Help file describes.

 

... This is not really a problem, however:

What appears to work: make an UNfilled circle, with wire width > radius. It's always poured,

and maintains circular shape even at small sizes, in manual and FreeStyle routing.

I can handle the Eagle polygon connectivity cleanup, a minor task at the end.

 

One further question:

On the Import side of the conversion, I should have translated the Eagle ULP to output directly to FST, instead of DSN (And I might still need to do that... :mellow: )

 

For Keepouts, the DSN lines for placement and routing keepouts both create RoutingKeepout->Wires areas:

 

(place_keepout(path "1#Top" 0.000000 408.000000 984.000000 344.000000 984.000000 344.000000 904.000000 408.000000 904.000000 408.000000 984.000000 ))

(wire_keepout(path "1#Top" 0.000000 408.000000 848.000000 344.000000 848.000000 344.000000 768.000000 408.000000 768.000000 408.000000 848.000000 ))

 

produces two rectangles: the place_keepout creates a 4-wire closed set of lines,

the wire_keepout creates a 4-sided polygon (with hatched fill).

The FST export of this is:

<Keepout>

<Role>

<Trace>

<LayerRef name="1#Top"/>

</Trace>

</Role>

<Polygon>

<Dot x="344" y="984"/>

<Dot x="344" y="904"/>

<Dot x="408" y="904"/>

<Dot x="408" y="984"/>

</Polygon>

</Keepout>

<Keepout>

<Role>

<Trace>

<LayerRef name="1#Top"/>

</Trace>

</Role>

<Line>

<Dot x="408" y="848"/>

<Dot x="344" y="848"/>

<Dot x="344" y="768"/>

<Dot x="408" y="768"/>

<Dot x="408" y="848"/>

</Line>

</Keepout>

 

...

 

The Via keepout works fine: it makes a "RoutingKeepout -> Vias, Layer: All" polygon.

 

I can hack the FST file, to change the <Role> to <Place side = "Top"/>,

and the polygon is created as a placement keepout, as expected.

________________

 

So, is my DSN placement keepout syntax correct?

It looks like it's *close* to what your parser wants, but not quite. :(

 

Many thanks, I am even enjoying this part...

-- JLC

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Cheers for the info, Joe.

 

We've fixed the bug so that import of place_keepout and via_keepout should be correct now.

*you need to wait for the latest release though, I'll update you on it*

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...I wrote an application to convert FST to Eagle SCR.

Using MS VC# 10 Express, the XML Namespace API(System.XML.Xpath) makes this task much easier.

 

Could you consider sharing this application with the rest of the TopoR community?

I know that there are plenty of us out there in need of importing the routed results back into Eagle.

 

Kind regards,

Eriond

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I'll have to check with the bosses. Classic American Intellectual Property policy applies here, unfortunately. :(

 

Have you seen the Eagle 6.x XML data format yet?

I suspect the export/import process will be ** MUCH ** easier now.

Eagle->FST, then FST->Eagle.

 

Naturally, now that I've burned hundreds of hours in getting export to DSN working, and translation to SCR...

this ULP-to-DSN / FST-to-SCR conversion process will be inferior and obsolete.:angry: :angry:

 

At this point, I'm on overload to finish the current design.

Sorry I can't help immediately; I will examine this as soon as I can.

-- Joe

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Have you seen the Eagle 6.x XML data format yet?

I suspect the export/import process will be ** MUCH ** easier now.

Eagle->FST, then FST->Eagle.

 

Yes, I have read through both the TopoR and Eagle file format documents, and realized that I have quite a way to go before I grasp the whole concept.

You see, I'm a GUI kind of guy, although I would say I'm a fairly good programmer. So before I embark on this journey that will easily consume 2-300 hours, I would need to know that we don't "re-invent the wheel" on each side...

It would also be nice to know if there is any work being done from Eremex on this Eagle suport issue? I was in contact with Elena a while ago, but haven't had anything confirmed yet.

Regards,Marcin

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Have you seen the Eagle 6.x XML data format yet?

I suspect the export/import process will be ** MUCH ** easier now.

Eagle->FST, then FST->Eagle.

 

Yes, I have read through both the TopoR and Eagle file format documents, and realized that I have quite a way to go before I grasp the whole concept.

You see, I'm a GUI kind of guy, although I would say I'm a fairly good programmer. So before I embark on this journey that will easily consume 2-300 hours, I would need to know that we don't "re-invent the wheel" on each side...

It would also be nice to know if there is any work being done from Eremex on this Eagle suport issue? I was in contact with Elena a while ago, but haven't had anything confirmed yet.

Regards,Marcin

 

I'll probably be upgrading my own Eagle to 6.x pretty soon (next 3 or 4 weeks). At that point, maybe we could team up on this. It's a

pretty flat problem, so would not be hard to divide up the XML coding stuff.

 

And maybe we could work out a deal with Eremex.... or maybe Maple would like to join the coding fun... :D

-- Joe

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I can confirm that we're currently working on Eagle <-> TopoR converter. Can't really give you exact release date, but it's expected by the end of spring. :)

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I can confirm that we're currently working on Eagle <-> TopoR converter. Can't really give you exact release date, but it's expected by the end of spring. :)

 

Thank you, Elena. Given this forecast, I can't see that neither myself, or Joe, will be able to do a comparable tool within the same (or shorter) timeframe. I'm also confident that your team, given their many-year long experience of coding, will do an excellent job. I'd love if you would consider integrating this feature into TopoR itself (instead of an external tool), but any solution is ok. I would be happy to help out with any beta-testing when available! rolleyes.gif

Thanx again! Great news!

/Marcin

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I can confirm that we're currently working on Eagle <-> TopoR converter. Can't really give you exact release date, but it's expected by the end of spring. :)

 

Thank you, Elena. Given this forecast, I can't see that neither myself, or Joe, will be able to do a comparable tool within the same (or shorter) timeframe. I'm also confident that your team, given their many-year long experience of coding, will do an excellent job. I'd love if you would consider integrating this feature into TopoR itself (instead of an external tool), but any solution is ok. I would be happy to help out with any beta-testing when available! rolleyes.gif

Thanx again! Great news!

/Marcin

 

 

 

Thanks for the update, Elena: I can just see Marcin and I finishing off a 90% effective tool, days before the real tool is posted! :wacko:

That's great news: especially since I now expect the bosses to crank up the work in the next couple months.

Keep up the good work -- Joe

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Hi all,

 

Just a bump (not really necessary; this was the second topmost thread...)

I'm of course eager to try out any converter stuff you might have come up with so far. I know its a busy period now before summer vacations, but still...

If you have an updated forecast we would appreciate if you could share it with us.

 

Kind regards,

Marcin

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We're still working on Eagle <-> TopoR convertor and for now we have "Import" (Eagle -> TopoR) on the stage of final testing, and "Export" (Eagle <- TopoR) is on the early stages.

 

Will keep you posted ;)

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Guest GIMEchip

We're still working on Eagle <-> TopoR convertor and for now we have "Import" (Eagle -> TopoR) on the stage of final testing, and "Export" (Eagle <- TopoR) is on the early stages.

 

Will keep you posted ;)

 

Just wondering if the EAGLE import/export will support earlier versions of EAGLE, or will it be 6.xx only?

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We're still working on Eagle <-> TopoR convertor and for now we have "Import" (Eagle -> TopoR) on the stage of final testing, and "Export" (Eagle <- TopoR) is on the early stages.

 

Will keep you posted ;)

 

Just wondering if the EAGLE import/export will support earlier versions of EAGLE, or will it be 6.xx only?

 

We are going to support only 6.xx versions, as starting from 6.0. EAGLE posted their XML format, which lets us make a converter.

You should try and find out if there's a way to make transition within EAGLE and get old files in 6.xx format.

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